Navigating Relationships When You're Struggling With Anxiety With The Decoding Couples

Navigating Relationships When You're Struggling With Anxiety With The Decoding Couples

Struggling with your mental health is hard! And it can definitely make it challenging to navigate relationships while you’re struggling with things like anxiety, panic and agoraphobia. Trust me, I get it. I met my partner while deeply struggling with panic and agoraphobia, and our relationship not only lasted, but has thrived for over a decade!

I’m super excited to be joined by Rachel Facio, LMFT and Stacey Sherrell, LMFT on this episode. Rachel and Stacey are both therapists and relationship experts, who provide real tools for real couples. They’re also hosts of the Decoding Couples Podcast, and just two very relatable, down-to-earth, funny and helpful human beings!

Before we hit record, so many of you reached out with lots of questions on this topic, so be sure to check out the full episode to hear everything we dived into; this one is filled with lots of valuable tools and advice. Let’s get into it!

Can I be in a relationship while I’m struggling?

A question I hear all the time from people navigating relationships and anxiety is: “Can I be in a relationship while I’m struggling?” In short, the answer is yes! 

A lot of people worry that they can’t be in a relationship while struggling, or that they aren’t capable of being a good partner. Being fully healed is not a prerequisite to entering a relationship, and having a supportive partner can actually be really helpful in the healing process, if that’s something that feels right to you. 

We are all on a continuous journey with our mental health, and this might look different from person to person. Rachel and Stacey agree that no one person is ever fully healed (and that’s ok!), so it’s important to be aware of your own needs and boundaries when in a relationship.

How do I navigate a relationship with severe anxiety?

This is such an important question to ask, and again, one that comes up a lot in this community. When you're struggling with anxiety, it's easy to feel like you're a burden on others. You start thinking, "Is what I'm going through too much for everyone else? Do they have to put up with me being scared all the time, avoiding places, and not wanting to do stuff?" It's not just about romantic relationships; it's about all connections. 

Rachel and Stacey remind us that we cannot control how others perceive our struggles, and it doesn’t reflect on our self-worth. We have to accept that individuals have their own limits and may be dealing with their own issues when in a relationship, so it’s important to get alignment around needs and boundaries.

Accepting Support in Relationships

It can be tough to accept support from others when we are struggling, and we often feel like we don’t want people to have to deal with our issues! But, true healing involves being vulnerable and letting others in. It’s about ditching the idea that anxiety defines everything about you and realizing that sharing your struggles can actually be a step towards recovery. 

Rachel and Stacey had so much more insight to share, including answers to these questions:

• How do I navigate conflict with my partner when I’m feeling so anxious?

• How can my partner be the support I want without becoming the crutch I “need.”

• How to fix the relationship and reignite the spark when anxiety leads to burn out?

To hear even more wisdom and the answers to these questions and more, check out the full episode!

Connect with Rachel & Stacey!

Free relationship tools & support from two relationship experts! Head here!

On Instagram: @decoding_couples

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Struggling with lots of what-if thoughts that lead to some really uncomfortable sensations and symptoms? Sign up for my 90-minute LIVE masterclass and learn how to approach your thoughts in a healthy (and very practical) way so that you can get freedom from them!

Feeling like you've tried everything but you're still struggling with lots of anxious thoughts, symptoms, panic attacks, and fears? Take my FREE 60-minute masterclass today and learn 5 shifts that will actually help you to overcome anxiety, panic disorder, and agoraphobia. And I promise, you won't hear any of the usual stuff from me - like doing breathing exercises, grounding practices, cutting out caffeine, and doing more exposures. Let's get you the peace and freedom you deserve without it being so hard!

Join my Instagram community here!

TRANSCRIPT

Shannon Jackson  00:02

Welcome to A Healthy Push Podcast. I'm Shannon Jackson, former anxiety sufferer turned adventure mom and anxiety recovery coach. I struggled with anxiety, panic disorder and agoraphobia for 15 years. And now I help people to push past the stuff that I used to struggle with. Each week, I'll be sharing real and honest conversations, along with actionable and practical steps that you can take to help you push past your anxious thoughts, the symptoms, panic and fears. Welcome. You're right where you're meant to be. Alright, today, I'm super excited because I have two ladies with me that I actually listen to their podcast. And before we hit record, I was like, Okay, this feels so surreal. And I feel like I'm fangirling a little bit. But I have Rachel and Stacey with me. And they're both therapists and relationship, relationship experts who provide real tools for real couples. And they are the host of the decoding couples podcast, and just two super relatable down to earth, funny, like helpful human beings. So Stacey, Rachel, welcome. I'm so happy to have you here on the podcast.

Rachel & Stacey  01:10

We're so happy to be here. Thank you.

01:12

Thank you.

Shannon Jackson  01:14

I'm so excited. So I reached out to my community. And basically, they were like, Okay, you're having relationship experts on, I really just want some of these questions answered. And I'm like, Oh, my gosh, I got so many good questions. And so I'm so excited to dig in. And I just have to say, both of you, of course, I want you guys to go check out their podcast, the decoding couples podcasts, because they share so much really good sound relationship advice. But because of both of your vulnerability, and courage to share what you do on your podcast, and to just speak, how you speak all of it, you really take so much shame out of relationship issues, like having relationship issues, navigating it, like and so I know, this is going to be really helpful conversation and sort of do the same right now for my community. So absolutely, yes. Okay, so of course, struggling with your mental health is incredibly hard, like in and of itself, and then trying to navigate your relationship, maybe, maybe find a relationship, maybe be in a relationship, it's incredibly hard, especially when you're struggling with things like anxiety and panic. And I think a lot of people think, I can't be in a relationship when I'm struggling, like, this just isn't going to work, or my partner is going to want to leave me like when they find out all this stuff, or they're, I don't want my partner to have to deal with me. Like, I think that they should just, you know, leave and not be with me and not have to, quote, deal with me. So let's start here and have a little conversation about all this because they think it's really helpful to just lay out like, can you be in a relationship when you're struggling with your mental health?

Rachel & Stacey  03:01

Yeah, yes, you can absolutely be in a relationship without feeling 100% With your mental health, I feel like that a while back, there was like a, like a quote going around that got traction about like, you can't be loved unless you're like, fully loved yourself for, you know, it was something around that vein, I don't remember exactly what it was. And as much as I understand that, like, sure, we want to be working on ourselves and making sure that we know our stuff and bringing awareness into relationships, this idea that like we have to be our best selves and have zero concerns or have a handle on anything in order to be loved or to feel safe, or to even just have relationships where we can have corrective experiences. relationally regardless if they are our person is necessary. Like we need that in order to heal and work through our mental health stuff. So yes, simple answer yet, you can be in a relationship while struggling.

Shannon Jackson  04:01

Dang, I was like, go ahead. I love that you said that those dc that it's not only can you get a relationship, but it's actually really helpful to be in a relationship. And I think we think right with a lot of things like I have to put my life on hold while I work to heal myself. And everything sort of has to stop in order for me to get better and then I can live and it's like, whoa, wait, that's not helpful. What are you gonna say?

Rachel & Stacey  04:34

I would say give him the under the Rachael given the asterisk. Yeah, it's

04:36

just so funny, because I think that I'm always trying to think about how when we're on, you know, our podcasts or any podcasts, like, just how anyone else would listen to it. And it's like, we always are speaking from our own attachment styles. And I'm just like, Yeah, and you can co regulate with someone. It's so important. I think Stacy's right you don't need it's unrealistic, right to be like completely healed. or like, I'm going to be whole. And you've got to also be having awareness of like, where you do need to do your healing because I do watch a lot of people either swing, one way of like, I'm unlovable because I'm struggling and because of my mental health, which just like isn't true. And not having maybe like boundaries or awareness that the that might be, you know, a definitely a slippery slope in the relationship. And so being able to be open to your partner, when they're like, hey, I need, you know, a break from A, B, and C, because like, I'm not really sure how to help you, but I still love you, or knowing like when your own boundaries, or maybe just like need to exist or be a little stronger, because your anxiety is really high, or maybe you're not able to regulate yourself. So like everything Stacy is saying is 100% Spot on. And part of getting to a place where you don't feel like shameful about that you're struggling or having mental health is also just, you know, knowing where your own stuff is that you need to work on to make sure that you don't kind of fulfill that. What's that like fulfilling prophecy of like, well, I'm not lovable, see, because then they told me that they need a break. It's like it's a balance, it's both you do not need to be fully healed, because none of us are, none of us are. And you've got to be aware and open to like your partner may need you know, to have some space may not be able to completely sue you in the way that you want. So that was like my only asterik. Because I could just see it in the DMS paying, like people being like, What do you mean? I'm like, oh,

Shannon Jackson  06:30

yeah, no, I'm so glad that you said that. I think that's really important. I know, when my husband and I met we, you know, I was struggling immensely with panic and agoraphobia, and I couldn't regulate. And we would have, you know, full blown fights and arguments. And I would just feel so bad because they felt like a lot of it was because of all this shame that I was carrying about. Just struggling just the fact that I was struggling so badly. And I didn't want things to look the way that they did. But it was so incredibly helpful for me throughout my journey, right to learn that, that that was a big part of why it kept popping up. Let him in and like communicate, how he could actually be helpful for me, too, was a big part of it.

07:17

Yeah. Cuz then you learn that you are separate, right from how your symptoms are presenting, I think so often, whatever we're struggling with, you feel like you're that thing, whether it's anxiety, depression, OCD, you feel the shame makes us feel like we are the behavior. But until we're able to, again, you'd have to be healed, but just to be open to this is what my partner needs in order to love me. Also, while I'm struggling, that's where you also get the space to be like, Oh, I can be struggling and I'm not unlovable, I can be struggling, because this is what I'm dealing with. But that doesn't mean I'm bad, or something's wrong with me. So like what you just said, Jan is like so key, because until you let them in and struggle with them, you're also not going to be able to realize like, oh, yeah, I struggle. And I'm still worth like all the good things.

Shannon Jackson  08:08

Yeah. So good. I think you, like you've touched on this already. But I think this is such an important one to ask. Because so many people are struggling with anxiety disorders feel like they're a burden, like, what I'm struggling with is so hard. And I feel like everyone has to deal with it. Like everyone has to deal with me being scared all the time, me being fearful me not wanting to go places not wanting to do things. So a lot of people ask that question of how do I not be seen as a burden to everyone around me not just like the romantic relationships, but all relationships.

Rachel & Stacey  08:46

This is so tricky. And I think you're right, that everybody that struggles in that way, maybe, and maybe not even just with anxiety with anything like you don't want to flood your people, you don't want to burn them out, it's hard to take up space. And there's a couple things at the end of the day, we can't control if somebody finds us a burden, right? Like if it is too much for somebody, that doesn't mean that you are too much. That just means that maybe they don't have the skills or capacity or going through their own stuff that they can't show up in a certain way. And that doesn't have to mean anything about you. So I do think that there has to be just a general acceptance that like everybody is functioning on their own and what their boundaries are and what your needs are, might not align. And then you have to reconsider what that relationship is or represents to you. It doesn't mean that the friendship or the family dynamic or the partnership is over. We also don't want people burning out on us right and forcing themselves to need to continually show up and hear the same thing over and over again and then it does create that outcome that we're afraid of. So I do think there has to be a general acceptance of, again, this is not what Rachel was saying earlier, like, this isn't about me, this is separate from me of how somebody else can show up. But that in itself is so much work, right? Like, being able to even separate that is is so much work. Second thing is I think like you have to be, it's uncomfortable to let people support you like I will, personally I am going through a transition period, like a rough a rough patch. And I recently just had like, some of my oldest friends come together to like, do a girls weekend, like flew different places from across the country to show up for me, and I like didn't want to go like I was so uncomfortable. Because it does feel like this is a lot like this is a lot just for me, I'm good. Like it is right. So there's a part of like, you have to tolerate that vulnerability in order for relationships to even be able to be healing for people to be able to show up for you. And that is hard, but gotta let it in. Like, yeah, the acceptance and the figuring out the discomfort with vulnerability is a huge part of moving forward.

Shannon Jackson  11:14

Yeah. Oh, I love that, Stacy. And thank you for being vulnerable. I think you you just hit the nail on the head because I was thinking back to my own experience. And a huge part of why I was seen as such a burden is because of the stories they told myself, right. It was like, My anxiety is who I am. And it's every every part of me is anxiety. And that's all people see. But it was also not being vulnerable, and not actually letting people support me because I I didn't want people to see it. I didn't want people to have to take it on. But like that is a big part of how you actually heal.

Rachel & Stacey  11:51

Oh my gosh, and it's so detrimental to our relationships to not like even just thinking of like Rachel and I like I struggle with a lot of anxiety in different ways. And it shows up for Rachel and like running our business together when I try to pretend like everything is fine, and it is clearly not and like Rachel is my best friend. Like she knows when I'm not okay, but I'm like white knuckling it. Yeah, try to like, I don't know, save her from something that she doesn't need to be saved from like it never it typically never ends. Well, you know what I like? Correct? Yeah, like good insight, right? Well, cuz and you've told me so many times, you're like, just fucking own it, like you don't like, just tell me what's happening and like, we'll be good versus showing up half assed or in an irritable way, or a way that has like shame attached to it. So it's like, we also if we want those healthy relationships, we have to show up as our full self and trust that Rachel will tell me when it's unhealthy or not working, or she needs boundaries, right? Like,

Shannon Jackson  12:53

yeah. Oh, for sure. I remember my husband getting so we were dating at the time, but he would get so frustrated with me. And he would say, I can't read your mind. Like, you've got to tell me, I don't know what to do. I don't know how to help, like, I'm trying and you're not letting me in. And so I'm just telling you to be calm and to not freak out.

13:12

And isn't that helpful? Doesn't that not make all your anxiety go? I just calmed.

Shannon Jackson  13:18

Right, it was the cure, it was cure for all my anxiety disorders. So I this was another big one. And I totally get it and I am just so interested to hear your insights on this. So a lot of people who are struggling with panic agoraphobia, or with partners who typically not always right, but partners who don't struggle with anxiety disorders, I think it's like this crazy. It was true for my husband and I like he was quote, carefree, like adventurous, never had anxiety would just be like, go do the things and don't worry about it. And I think that's true for a lot of people that they're paired with people who don't really understand anxiety disorders and so a big question that I got asked it is how do I make my people understand what it's like because they think they think if I can make them understand it's going to somehow make things easier. So let's talk about that.

14:17

Well, I mean, we could go down the attachment rabbit hole right but like most anxiously attached individuals and avoidant Lee attached individuals, like find each other in the universe and then decide to be together for talking about monogamous relationships. That is a thing and it's quite the dominant pairing, aka Stacey and I and we just plays out all over the internet. But I feel I feel for my anxious peeps, because I think what also happens is anxiety is pretty dysregulated. Right? It makes you actually feel a lot of feelings. But I think when you're trying to share that with a partner, you're only communicating the anxiety and Stacy and I talked about this a lot that like, usually, when someone's like, I'm anxious, we're like, okay, but what else? Like what, what else are you feeling? They're like, Well, no, I'm, I'm anxious. And they're really going into detail about like that anxiety. And if you're not an anxiously attached individual or you don't struggle with anxiety, that doesn't mean a lot to you, you're kind of looking at your partner like, Okay, calm, calm down there, you know, very helpful response or like, take some deep breaths. And so I say that because anxiety can be almost like this, like whole, like white noise kind of feeling. But there's usually other things attached to it, like you're usually really fearful or you're sad, or you're hurt it think of like to chain links together. And so if you're a person that feels like your partner doesn't get it, and you want them to, number one, anxiety is doing its job, it's making you feel like you're feeling stuff, but you're not, it's just like a it's like a almost a little bit of a state that has other things connected to it. And it's a real feeling. But there's so much more now, like connected to it. I think that's what the partner needs to hear. So what else is kind of influencing your anxiety? Could you name other feelings outside your anxiety, because anxiety has a tendency to keep us in that state and reinforce it over and over again. And for a partner that doesn't feel those things are looking at you with those deer in the headlights? Like, that's not helpful, I will tend to repeat ourselves over and over again, or kind of go into the minutiae of the detail. And you're and then you're watching your partner, not connect with you, which only fuels your anxiety more. Yeah,

Shannon Jackson  16:30

yeah, let me explain more. Let me know.

Rachel & Stacey  16:34

I will make you get it. But yeah, same detail over and over. Yeah, I mean, to Rachel's point, like, I don't, I don't know if this is an unpopular opinion or not. But as somebody who has anxiety, I think the idea that our partner needs to fully get an understand it is actually a trap, like, what you're saying, like, and I get the want to be heard and felt, but I do think what is more important is understanding like, how can you then if your partner doesn't like get anxiety doesn't get it? How can you still explain to them how you need to be supported? How can you let them know how they can show up for you. And I think that that is the more important thing to like stress and make sure that they are able to do if you know you struggle with anxiety, then like to fully embody what anxiety is, because they don't need to know if they're able to still show up and support you and help in a healthy way. That is more of what the partnership is about, in my mind.

Shannon Jackson  17:34

Ya know, I'm so glad that you said that, Stacy, I tell my students that I work with my clients all the time, I think it's less about getting those people around you to understand. And your desire is really lying and wanting to be heard and wanting to be validated. And that's so much more helpful. Because even if you've struggled with an anxiety disorder, like I grew up with a mom who did, she got it, like she freaking got it, but she could not like really get my experiences and what I was going through, you know, as a teenager and into my young adult years, like she kind of understood, but it wasn't like she was living it. So I could tell my mom until I was blue in the face, but I really just wanted her to listen and to be there and to say I'm here regarding no matter what. And I know it's hard. And so those simple things, I think we overlook them. But they're so so helpful.

18:27

Oh yeah, definitely trying to remember to it feeling seen and heard is so important. And if the words they're saying are not resonating with you, or you're feeling like oh, they just don't get it. Okay, so how can they show up for you? Like, try and shift? What would you want the positive behavior to look like? Because I guarantee that if they said, Oh, I really understood, I hear you, I understand how you feel, you're gonna be like, well, like more, I need more further confirmation that you understand how I feel. And that's a trap, right? That's going to make your anxiety worse. So trying to remember to go okay, if I'm feeling like they're not getting it because of the weather reflecting back because I guarantee your partner's not perfect, just like we all aren't, how do I want them to show up for me? What would feel really good? If they did in the moment right now that would make me feel seen and heard what's an actionable thing I can tell them versus I'm going to need these words or I'm going to nitpick on how they reflected it back to me, that's actually going to make your anxiety worse.

Shannon Jackson  19:21

So good. So good. So you both talk about this a lot. Right? Navigating conflict, and it's incredibly hard to navigate conflict period and relationships. When you're struggling with anxiety, of course, there are so many layers, like we know and people will say, you know, when I'm really feeling heightened when I'm incredibly activated and anxious. I don't know how to navigate any of it like it just seems so overwhelming. Do you have any words of wisdom for when somebody is feeling incredibly anxious and they're in the midst of conflict and they're just like, I don't know. I don't even know like to do just

20:01

watch Stacy and I just like watch one of our work fights. And then you could just you could take from what you want from it right? We should stray oming those don't

Shannon Jackson  20:10

think we should record, it would be incredibly entertaining.

Rachel & Stacey  20:13

Oh my god. So I think you have to listen to that feeling that says I can't navigate this right now one of the worst things anybody can do, whether you struggle with anxiety or anger or overwhelm, or you know, depression, or whatever it is, if you feel flooded, there's a reason why you do and you have to listen to that nothing good comes anybody that that follows Rachel and I like we are on our self regulation. So box every single day, like, there is nothing good that comes from being dysregulated and trying to work through a fight. And so I do think that part of that work, like even going back to our first question of like, can you be in a relationship when you're working through stuff? It's like, this is one of those relational corrective experiences, how do you take control of your own stuff, to be able to regulate to show up to your relationship conflict in a healthy way. And if you can't figure that out, like, it's not going to translate to any relationship like that is just a life skill that we all should have been taught all throughout school, there should be a class in college that we all had to take on it like that self regulation is so incredibly important. So if you're dysregulated, listen to it, and then figure out how to take your space like, boundaries, all of it self regulation. Yeah. Oh,

Shannon Jackson  21:41

yeah, I, gosh, this was me. And I get it when people ask this question. I would, of course, when you're feeling so anxious, you just feel like, you're either gonna freeze, you're gonna lash out, you're gonna just get away from it as quickly as you can. And, like, I did all of the things. But I never stopped to say, it makes sense. Like, what you're feeling and how you're feeling makes sense. And like, Listen to yourself and give yourself what you need right now. It was just always like, what I've got to figure this out. I've got a I mean, that's anxiety. Right? So

Rachel & Stacey  22:12

right, well, yeah, that's the poll is like with when you feel anxiety, the actual key to getting through it is figuring out how to tolerate it. But it feels so intolerable. You want to say and do to make it stop. And so it's so counterintuitive to be like, this is going to pass it always does. So how do I verbalize that? I need space. So I'm speaking from a clear space, and I'm not speaking out of this wants to feel differently. I mean, that is so exhausting, right? That is, that is like how you conquer anxiety. But it's hard, though, when a different person that you love and triggers you it's the recipe for for struggle.

Shannon Jackson  22:54

Yeah. Oh, for sure. In any way. Like, of course, everyone is like, there's kids, tell me something else, Stacy, there's gotta be a better way.

Rachel & Stacey  23:01

If someone else can find it.

Shannon Jackson  23:05

I know, I'll take the magical thing. So I think that another thing that's tricky when you're struggling with an anxiety disorder is wanting to be supported by your partner. But many times we find our partners enabling us if this makes sense. So, like, when I was struggling with anxiety, my husband would often say, It's okay, you're gonna be okay, this isn't that big of a deal. You can, you know, and just always sort of saying, we don't have to do this, we can find another way we we can cancel, it's fine. And rather than being helpful, right, he was very enabling of the anxiety. It was just I'll give you a way out. I will make you not have to face this. I will. And of course, he thought that he was being helpful, because he just didn't know and neither really did I but I also had a little bit of knowing there and I was like, oh, no, this feels better. Like he's gonna help me. He's gonna like say, you don't have to do this. So how can your partner actually support you without enabling?

24:12

Well, I'll speak from the partners perspective and Stacy nice relationship because that's appropriate. That's what we do all the time anyway. For the partner that has an anxious partner, you have got to learn that you like you still love them, even if you can't fix their anxiety. And sometimes that looks like allowing, like the discomfort to just be there. So like, I'll give you an example. Sometimes when Stace is feeling superduper anxious and kind of comes in and I can tell right like so if you're in a relationship you can tell when your partner has already like started maybe feeling anxious, it's one it's really winding up. And so I'm aware of right like I'm aware that she is maybe not feeling her best self, but she's pretty anxious and she's Talking that with me out loud or her thoughts are kind of in that anxious lens. And so when she says something that she is either maybe I don't think it's conscious all the time wanting me to like solution fix with her, or say like, this is totally fine. I've had to learn that sometimes I'm just like, okay, like, I hear that, like, I don't do the soothing all the time, or I'm not like, here's the solutions, I let it be almost incongruent with like my experience, like, even if it's like, I think we should go paint our building red today. And I'm like, Oh, I hear that. That's what you'd like to do. Like, that didn't happen. But you know, like, oh, okay, I don't see it that way. And that's it, like, I don't try to convince her that like, red is a bad color, or that we're gonna get kicked out of our office building for doing that, you know, like, I really just allow it to like, sit in the discomfort and sometimes Stace does not like that very much. Sometimes she's like, okay, you know what, like, I'm going to keep trudging in my own anxiety. And she says that, like, Look, I just need to be anxious right now about this. And can you kind of like, leave me be, but I've had to learn as the partner like, it's okay for us to have that discomfort because it is important for me to show her like, I don't see it that way. And I don't love you any less for not seeing it that way. And it's important for her to see that like, yeah, I don't, I don't see what you're seeing or feeling. But like, I still love you, and I'm still my own person, that is not where you are. So like, that's a long answer in a way of like, how to not enable is Be authentic about that. That's not your experience, but with like kindness and empathy. But allowing that like incongruence that rub that discomfort to happen, I think can just help slow your partner down a little bit without you having to regulate for them or fix it for them or enable it. How does it feel to be on the receiving end of that stays?

Rachel & Stacey  26:52

Yeah, no, it's true. And it definitely pisses me off. But when you go the other way, like, I know that it again, like in our, in our partnership, like it's also been an issue where it causes resentment for Rachel like to over function in certain ways, or to over function for my anxiety, or, you know, those more enabling things. Like I think that, yeah, for the anxious partner, it's typically not helpful to your point, Shannon, but then for the non anxious partner, I do think when you are trying to throw spaghetti at the wall, and you're sacrificing yourself, you know, or doing things that you don't really want to do. Like, it's also not helpful for the dynamic. And so it's a learning curve and trial and error. But yeah, figuring out how to sit with the discomfort on both sides, like stops, the stops the enabling, enabling cycle, and then also you figure out what's what then is going to actually be helpful, because I don't want Rachel to be resentful of me, like, I don't want her to do things that make her feel a certain way. You know, like, because she thinks that's what I need. Like, that doesn't help my anxiety or make me feel good, either. So it's like, we all have to figure out what what works. And that's part of the work in a dynamic. Yeah.

Shannon Jackson  28:11

Oh, for sure. I have so much goodness here, but I think not resentment, right. It can be so tricky, because you convince yourself as the person struggling that the other person right is just so overwhelmed, so sick of all your shit, like on their last string at all times wanting to leave and that's not necessarily the reality. But I also look back or anything. I'm sure my husband at many times felt frustrated felt, you know, maybe like it wasn't fair. But it didn't take any of the love that he had for me away didn't didn't change any of the feelings that he had. For me. It was like he could feel frustrated, he could feel upset, he could feel maybe disappointed or any of the things but he still loved me and cared about me, but I learned right, I have to actually help him. And help that starts with me helping myself which is really freaking hard. So hard. So I'm curious if if somebody is in a spot where they feel like anxiety has really like taken a toll on our relationship. They're feeling like, you know, my partner's clearly burnt out. We're not that like the spark just doesn't, isn't there? Like it feels like we're so disconnected. Feels like the love is gone. Like what do you say to that?

Rachel & Stacey  29:36

I think if somebody showed up in my office saying that, I would probably say that it's not just about the anxiety if all it is that if somebody's anxiety is what is like breaking a relationship down like, I don't know, like if that was all they were like, it is just this I would say that dynamic has probably participated Did and other unhealthy behaviors I think it I think it's really fair for somebody to feel like a partner isn't a good fit because of it like that, that could just not work. And like that is such a difficult conversation. And it's that's realistic, but I would say we're like, No, we love each other. It's but like, it's just like his anxiety, his anxiety is what is like bringing our relationship down, I'd probably be like, take a step back and like, look at look at what else is going on? Yeah,

30:31

no, no, I think Stacy's saying something very fair that it's so hard. When you put time and effort and you like love somebody, you want it to work so badly. And I think regardless of intact attachment style, but specifically anxiety, you know, if you're pinning it all on that one thing, I do think there's other things we need to look at. And it's sometimes it's the most painful, but freeing decision, you can have to have a conversation of like, this isn't working. And if we're all doing everything we can, if your partner is saying like, this is all I can do, and you feel like you're at your wit's end, your burnout, the spark is gone, whatever it is, you've got to like, accept that and work from that place versus hoping they show up for you in a different way that's going to check that box and fill and heal that resentment and also prevent it from happening in the future. Like all of that is not real. Like that's just not how relationships work. And sometimes the hardest conversation can be not, how will you change for me? But like, do we have enough in us to change together? Because that's what gets people through stuff. It's not your person being more perfect or less anxious? Because then this box will be checked, like life gets lifee. So if you can work from a place of, are we all doing everything we can? And if the answer's no, like that's, that's painful, but that's a better and more empathetic place, then this is wrong because of them. And because of their anxiety, like, stay sad. I feel like there's like, um, that's a little fishy to me. Yeah,

Shannon Jackson  32:03

no, I agree. It's hard to see it, you know, when you're in it. Totally. Yeah, it's so hard to recognize. Because looking back, of course, my anxiety played a big role in a lot of the relationship issues that my husband and I had, but there is so much more there. And actually digging into all that stuff was incredibly helpful. So I just have to say, I love both of you. Your podcast is so relatable ever, like how you approach things, even just in this conversation, like you two are doing exactly what you're meant to be doing. And it's just so cool to see it. And even though Rachel has given you a bit of a hard time, Stacy, in this conversation, it's so good to just feel like you're people and you got it and like this is normal, and just so much acceptance, right in relationships and in life. And it's such a big component of, you know, healing and just having really healthy good relationships. And yeah, everything you've shared, I've just, I love it. I want to encourage people to go find you. So Rachel or Stacey, where can people find and connect with you if they want to learn more?

Rachel & Stacey  33:18

Our biggest, our biggest place where we're showing up most regularly is on Instagram. So that is decoding underscore couples. But like you have mentioned, we also have a podcast that has episodes out every week for deeper dives on relationship topics. And that's the decoding couples podcast. And you can find that on YouTube or wherever you listen to your podcasts. So,

Shannon Jackson  33:38

so good. I appreciate you both. Thank you so much for coming on. It's been such an amazing conversation.

Rachel & Stacey  33:44

Thanks for having us.

Shannon Jackson  33:48

I hope you enjoyed this episode of A Healthy Push. If you want more, head on over to a healthy push.com for the show notes, and lots more tips, tools and inspiration that will support your recovery. And if you're hoping for me to cover a certain topic, be sure to join my Instagram community at healthy push and let me know in the comments what you want to hear next.